[R6RS] my notes on today's conference call (11 April 2007)
William D Clinger
will at ccs.neu.edu
Wed Apr 11 10:17:22 EDT 2007
telephone conference April 11 2007 8:00am-10:00am EDT
Mike, Anton, Will, Kent present by about 8:02am;
Matthew (in China) joined temporarily at 8:27am,
on a very poor connection, and rejoined on a better
connection a few minutes later. We skipped around
the agenda some to delay our consideration of agenda
items that needed Matthew's expertise or vote, but
my notes preserve the original order of the agenda,
not the order in which we considered the items.
0. finalize agenda (1 minute)
1. action items (1 minute)
- record response votes (All)
ongoing
- draft concrete proposal for making conditions more like
records---or not (ticket 210) (Mike)
done
- draft concrete proposal for change in exception handling
protocol---or not (ticket 221) (Mike)
done
- redraft response for ticket 201 (Will) [done]
done
- revise (shorten) draft response for ticket 200 (Kent) [done]
done
- draft responses for ticket numbers
208: eliminate library export immutability loophole
to be done after today's meeting
209: Syntactic datums and datum values
done
210: Why are simple conditions so different from records
done
221: Recursive exception handling considered harmful
done
165:
done last night
- update ticket-nnn responses to reflect decisions:
151: reject formal comment
204: go with option B
211: move when and unless into base library
214: reject suggestion to replace "lookahead" with "look-ahead"
216: reject comment; possibly add footnote acknowledging Boolean
220: map should not modify earlier return values
223: will add string <=> unicode conversion procedures with
"replace" semantics
229: mention that bytevectors can be used with record wrapper
and srfi can replicate string functionality; string-ref
and string-set *should* be O(1)
- update r6rs to reflect additional decisions:
- probably use "should" for programmer requirements that implementations
are not required to enforce
- change the specifications of char-alphabetic?, char-whitespace?, and
string-titlecase to conform with Unicode 5?
(http://lists.r6rs.org/pipermail/r6rs-discuss/2007-April/002250.html)
- adopt Posix semantics for set-port-position! when underlying
object is a file or bytevector output port, with unwritten bytes
having unspecified values
- move formal semantics to a nonnormative appendix
- deferred until after April 15
- add port-length and port-has-port-length? procedures
and corresponding arguments to custom port makers?
NOTE: tickets whose responses are not yet accepted and by whom:
*135: Will, Matthew, Mike, Anton 150: Will, Matthew, Mike, Anton
+151: Kent, Mike, Anton 152: Mike, Anton
-155: Will, Anton 156: Mike
160: Mike, Anton 161: Anton
-164: All -165: All
166: Mike, Anton -170: Will, Anton
-176: Will, Kent, Matthew, Anton 183: Mike
184: Mike 186: Mike
*189: Will, Mike, Anton 198: Mike
*200: Will, Mike, Anton 201: Mike, Anton
202: Will, Matthew, Mike, Anton +204: All
205: Mike 207: Mike
-208: All -209: All
-210: All +211: All
212: Mike, Anton 213: Mike, Anton
214: All 215: Mike, Anton
+216: Will, Kent, Matthew, Anton 217: Will, Mike, Anton
+220: Will, Kent, Matthew, Anton -221: Will, Kent, Matthew, Anton
-222: Will, Matthew, Mike, Anton 223: Mike, Anton
-224: Will, Kent, Matthew, Anton 225: Mike, Anton
-226: Will, Kent, Matthew, Anton -227: Will, Kent, Matthew, Anton
+229: All
- awaiting technical decision
+ response does not yet reflect technical decision
* questions/comments:
135: Kent needs to fix first bullet point [done]
189: Anton would like help with this response
200: Kent needs to shorten this response [done]
2. end game
- we have four days left to publish responses
- same process as last time?
- volunteer to clean up tickets
Anton volunteered
- meetings before and after April 15
deferred to end of conference
3. eliminate library export immutability loophole? (5 minutes)
- ticket 208
- motion 1: include implicit only-once wrapper around rhs of each
library definition
- options: should or must raise exception?
- motion 2: include implicit only-once wrapper around rhs of each
definition, letrec, and letrec* rhs
- options: should or must raise exception?
Kent makes motion 2 with "should"; Will seconded
vote:
yes: Will, Kent, Mike, Anton
no: Matthew
4. keep the other little library: (r6rs case-lambda)? (5 minutes)
- we moved when-unless into (r6rs base), what about case-lambda?
no one here opposes putting all three into a separate library,
but what to name it?
Anton moved we name it (r6rs control), and put
when, unless, and case-lambda in it; Mike seconded
vote:
yes: Will, Matthew, Mike, Anton
abstain: Kent
Mike moved we move do from (r6rs base) into (r6rs control);
Matthew seconded
vote:
yes: Will, Kent, Matthew, Mike, Anton
Will moved we move call/cc and dynamic-wind into (r6rs control),
but the motion failed for lack of a second
5. Export bindings for various literals? (10 minutes)
- ticket 164
- literals that can appear where non-literals are legitimate:
- syntax-rules underscore (_), ellipses (...)
- cond else
- quasiquote unquote, unquote-splicing
- quasisyntax unsyntax, unsyntax-splicing
- others?
- literals that can appear only where literals are legitimate:
- case else
- define-record-type fields, mutable, etc.
- others?
- literals in the library syntax not (presently) an issue
- export, import
- only, rename, etc.
- and, or, >, etc.
- tabled last week when Matthew dropped out
go with the simple solution: export bindings for all identifiers
6. change formal semantics? (5 minutes)
- tickets 226 (drop library toplevel), 227 (drop define and begin^f)
- Will says we should do what the formal comment suggests
we can say we will pass the comment on
to the authors of the formal semantics
7. should formal semantics contain "complicating optimizations"
- ticket 222
we can say we will pass the comment on
to the authors of the formal semantics
8. eq? and eqv? should apply to all standardized objects (5 minutes)
- ticket 155
- Will believes the draft response is incorrect
but Will has no problem with the recently revised response
9. asymmetry between fold-left and fold-right (5 minutes)
- ticket 170
- Will says procedure arguments should come first
Anton will draft another response and we'll discuss by email
when we came back to this later, we decided to keep the
current order of arguments, rejecting the formal comment
10. rename named let? (5 minutes)
- ticket 165
Anton will reword with "a majority of the editors" and
"<bindings>" for "bindings"
vote
yes: Will, Kent, Matthew, Mike, Anton
11. Syntactic datums and datum values (5 minutes)
- ticket 209
The first line of the current draft response is adequate.
The rest of the current draft response should be deleted.
12. get-bytevector-some may be difficult to implement (5 minutes)
- ticket 224
response will be revised to agree with the second fix,
substituting "bytes" for "characters"
13. Raising of exceptions should not be ambiguous or confusing (5 minutes)
- ticket 176
- Will says the response defends early arity checks
Will wouldn't have a problem with the current response
if the formal comment had not been truncated
We'll plan to meet again next week (18 April) in case we
haven't approved all of the responses to draft comments.
Discussion of unapproved draft responses to various tickets.
170: keep argument order consistent with Haskell etc;
point out that SRFI-1 doesn't use the name fold-left
151: should refer to response to 212
152: current draft response no longer explains our position(s)
Will volunteers to draft response regarding text slices etc
Kent will draft responses for the other two recent formal comments
The response to formal comment 223 should mention our recent
approval of bytevector <-> string conversions.
14. adjourned about 9:45am
Will
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